Does need ReactOS a NT7+ driver compat layer?

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Julcar
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Does need ReactOS a NT7+ driver compat layer?

Post by Julcar » Mon Jun 25, 2018 9:39 pm

This question is about the fact that as Windows NT 5.x are not longer supported by MS, hardware manufacturers only distribute drivers for supported Windows versions (at this moment 7+), and ReactOS can have a serious trouble as could be tagged as an obsolete only hardware support, that can be a good niche for the OS itself, but the community would like to have the ability of use newer hardware drivers, so, my question is, does need ReactOS a NT7+ driver compatibility layer for this?

karlexceed
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Re: Does need ReactOS a NT7+ driver compat layer?

Post by karlexceed » Mon Jun 25, 2018 10:33 pm

The plan is to get there eventually.

The best resource for NT6+ info I've found on the wiki currently is here: https://www.reactos.org/wiki/User:Petr- ... PI_support

Rosh
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Re: Does need ReactOS a NT7+ driver compat layer?

Post by Rosh » Tue Jun 26, 2018 1:22 am

Julcar wrote: NT7+ driver compatibility layer
Why "NT7" instead of NT6.2?
Windows is NT10 , right?

Does WINE Windows Vista + functions be used in ReactOS (at least for newer applications) ?
Is matter of kernel?
What is ReactOS kernel status (detailed info) ?

karlexceed
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Re: Does need ReactOS a NT7+ driver compat layer?

Post by karlexceed » Tue Jun 26, 2018 6:02 am

FYI:
Windows NT 3.1 (1993)
Windows NT 3.5 (1994)
Windows NT 3.51 (1995)
Windows NT 4 (1996)
Windows NT 5.0 (Windows 2000) (1997-1999)
Windows NT 5.1 (Windows XP) (2001)
Windows NT 5.2 (Windows Server 2003, Windows XP x64) (2003)
Windows NT 6.0 (Windows Vista, Windows Server 2008) (2006)
Windows NT 6.1 (Windows 7, Windows Server 2008 R2) (2009)
Windows NT 6.2 (Windows 8, Windows Server 2012) (2012)
Windows NT 6.3 (Windows 8.1, Windows Server 2012 R2) (2013)
Windows NT 10.0 (Windows 10, Windows Server 2016) (2015)
For information about NT versions (sadly, I haven't found a good resource for the specific/technical differences between versions):
https://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_NT
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compariso ... ndows_NT_2
http://www.geoffchappell.com/studies/wi ... /index.htm

For information about the NT architecture: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Architect ... Windows_NT

And as for ROS - the goal is NT 5.2 compatibility. At least for the 1.0 release. But the beginnings of Compatibility Mode are already being stubbed in and sketched out: https://www.reactos.org/wiki/User:Petr- ... ility_mode

Hopefully someone with deeper knowledge of the dev side can step in and provide a more specific answer for you.
Last edited by karlexceed on Tue Jun 26, 2018 6:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Rosh
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Re: Does need ReactOS a NT7+ driver compat layer?

Post by Rosh » Tue Jun 26, 2018 5:46 pm

karlexceed wrote:FYI: Hopefully someone with deeper knowledge of the dev side can step in and provide a more specific answer for you.
I`m waiting for that. :D

Fraizeraust
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Re: Does need ReactOS a NT7+ driver compat layer?

Post by Fraizeraust » Tue Jun 26, 2018 7:05 pm

The OP probably meant NT 6.x (Vista+) release versions and not NT 7. Microsoft never published such a release like this.

The difference between NT 5.x and the successor version releases, 6.x, mainly lies down to major PnP refurbishment (Plug n' Play module -- the main guy behind supporting and managing drivers), new APIs and some code changes to the NT kernel. So yes, NT 6.x layer compatibility is eventually needed for ReactOS to support newer drivers for hardware not compatible with the earlier NT 5.x release stack.
Rosh wrote:Windows is NT10 , right?
Windows 10 is NT 10 as release version but that's just for marketing reasons. The inner core of Windows 10 is still NT 6.x, 6.4 respectively (Vista+).
Rosh wrote:Does WINE Windows Vista + functions be used in ReactOS (at least for newer applications) ?
Is matter of kernel?
What is ReactOS kernel status (detailed info) ?
ReactOS does have a layer compatibility shim and some of NT 6 API functions in its own for supporting software from NT 6.x onwards but it's still under experimentation and not finished. I'm not so sure about WINE Vista+ functions therefore I can't answer this question. I will leave this to the developers.

As for the status of the ReactOS kernel, the core base is there however it's far from being complete and stable. More work has to go and to have compatibility with NT 6 we must reach NT 5 full support first. There are many bugs that affect the OS notably from Mm (memory manager), Cc (cache manager), Win32k/GDI (graphics/windowing manager stuff) and many others.

PurpleGurl
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Re: Does need ReactOS a NT7+ driver compat layer?

Post by PurpleGurl » Sun Aug 05, 2018 5:32 pm

If I'm not mistaken, ReactOS is currently only working to shim the user side and emulate higher version. At the lower layer, it is still 2003 server. I don't know if the devs can/will shim the driver side, though that might be easier in Vista/7 as I think they add an extra layer (as evidenced by not having to reboot after every driver change such as sound and network drivers if the drivers are written with that in mind, but still need a reboot after chipset and video drivers), but I am not sure.

I do wonder if it is possible to shim drivers to work in a version other than written for, but I don't understand the differences in APIs used by different driver versions. Sometimes you can use drivers for older Windows in Windows, but it depends. I mean, take the driver written for Windows 3.x to use the internal speaker as a sound card. I've used it under 9x, and perhaps even 2000 and/or XP unless I remember wrong.

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